> ooh-ee feedback! :O
> tl;dr warning. rambling ahead. Same warning here. Except... MORE SO!
Also, I copied this and answered off-line, so > is commenting Corta and >> is commented from the document.
> gonna be a while before I can actually do any of this, but hopefully I can get BHGH done in 2~3 months time so I can get stuck in
Plan before implementing? MADNESS lies down that path!!
> goes one step deeper than that... it wasnt really even meant to be 'playable' neither.
> but yeah,there's SO much more stuff in there than when things started.
> I can totally see the need for a 'full' rework, just the template wouldnt be the place for (all of) it -- anyways, point-by-point. Okay, so we may have some differences as to the purpose of template itself.
What I see is basically a character generator for 2d characters. Preferably one that can be included into
another project or somehow generate characters that can be used in other games, either as the playable character
or as another character in the world.
What is the template to you?
> > Test chamber
> Something I've been planning for.... years now.
> basically, I eventually want to make a full set of engagements for the model and various partners, and then be able to plug it into any game.
> it's never left planning stage, but I've taken great inspiration from skyrim's osex and a-chat's systems.
> so, that's the aim. This sounds great for fostering others to make their games, but should perhaps be a different module altogether.
One the template can utilise, as an example how a program uses your new module. There might even be a *gasp* tutorial...
> > save system
> getting a system that actually stays saved was an issue, back when I made it for splat.
> looking into a "save a file" save deal for BHGH, I'd plan the same for here.
> save to get a file, and then be able to upload to reload it or even move the character into another game.
> (like the animation suite. see > test chamber) Yes, that would mean others could crate a game without the need to create the character generator itself.
I am sure that would make new projects easier to start. The creator could focus on the gameplay and environment.
One thing about saving is if you stay saved, a way to clear everything would be nice.
I sometimes restart to get rid of stuff. Like at present nothing clears mess from forearms. It's a bug. Similar bugs
that inevitably will creep up may be more serious if you came back to the same character.
that inevitably will creep up may be more serious if you came back to the same character.
> > when it comes to colors, the color picker idea is to have similar hues grouped, not millions of colors but a good number of distinct and applicable color options.
> gonna plan to map it up to be a bit more like FYC's colour picker.
> with just two buttons there's variety, space-saving and it's still fairly easy to navigate It's still the same idea: grouping of similar hues and the variations of them. What I drew up is merely the structure
expanded in a 2d plane. The different choices all shown, instead of cycled through.
Obviously 2 buttons is way smaller than what I had, but in my multiple tab I had the screen estate to spare.
You should probably create it as a widget, seeing as you'll need to pick colors for skin, hair, lips and eyes.
And possibly hair/secondary, ornament, mess, maybe even cloth.
> > The pages are organized as tabs .. selection is done by clicking a part of the body
> it's a prefectly good idea, but not at all what I'm looking for in the template.
> the main idea being costume/character design, and adding extra clicks between costume parts will slow mix-n-matching down.
> (not to mention that moving the layout around between tabs will leave you 'lost' for a moment before you find out where you were)
Well, the amount of buttons was such that even when I was on my largest monitor with the template at full screen mode,
I several times missclicked. Even in the wrong row, changing the wrong part. I can not see how one screen can hold
all of them and remain useful. (I was looking at the character, not mouse cursor when this happened. I expect others
would too.)
All the costume buttons (except for helmets and piercings) are purposefully in the same screen exactly so
you wouldn't need to change screens when you are working on your outfit. Even those two could be moved there.
> really, though.. the 'by-part' system wasn't actually planned to be what the player actually sees.
> costumes would be designed like that, then turned into outfits (like at the bottom) for ease of use.
> plus then, stripping can actually work too! I do not exactly understand what you mean.
Are you saying there should be no ready made outfits, or that they aren't placed first, or that the
generator only has ready made outfits to choose from?
How do you see the by-part part? One screen/program where you only assemble clothes into outfits, another
where you do other stuff? Or do you still intend on cramming everything into one screen/tab?
> > Face/hair screens
> for the 'real' game, it's a must. ... but it's gonna stay simple in there.
I made the plan to make this the best character generator for 2d games. I think your mileage varies.
I don't see this as a game at all - no gameplay. It could be a good asset for them, though.
> cant promise anything on brow/nose layers, but I've been meaning to sort through all the faces
> .. to find out how many dupes I've actually got in there
> also, love the fanned layout of the colours <3 Heh, yeah. It's there to show that having the colors around the layout is pretty flexible.
> eyes will be split into two buttons (a bit like hair) one picker for style and one for the actual colour
>
> and if I was gonna add noses, it'd probably land somewhere on the acc/body layers rather than being it's own slot
> (I think rikku something like it, but it'd work like any other skin-coloured accessory)
> and I cant really make out much in the compressed shots there, but when I'm past BHGH I'll have a go at bringing in some snoot variety The nose thing really is very small, but to my eyes changes the face a lot. You don't see any 3d character generator
that allows you to change eyes and brow but has no nose setting.
Merely making the nose a straight line from tip to just below the nose bridge instead of inward curve is a great
change. In my eyes, if nobody elses.
If nose shapes would be best implemented as an accessory, why not?
> > how about limb thickness? Ass and stomach size alteration certainly would appeal to some people.
> limb thickness is probably gonna be a no, Figured it might well be. But I didn't want to assume.
> most of the bodies do a pretty good job of 'looking' different while still keeping the shape though.
> .. shame I cant draw 'em anything like how hedgehog does I think the clothes make much of it. As one who can't draw either, I feel you.
> butt sizes. sure. probably gonna happen. it's inevitable.
I wonder how much butts can alter if the rest of the body doesn't before it's just silly or even repulsive.
> as for the stomach, I'll probably (finally) cave into the pregnancy crowd and make something for that.
> .. even though babies are ick. -_- I am uncertain whether they are more numerous or vocal. As kinks go, I suppose it's one of the less
radical ones. Which is why developers are more likely to include it, which may make the group seem larger or
more influential still.
> > I attempted to draw a more natural gravity compliant breast selectors, but a) I can't b) I don't think they are feasible. Are they?
> they use the same animations on all sizes, so having all of them lining up is an issue..
> if I angled them down more, there's a worse chance that busty girls have their nipples slide right off during a bounce :\
How about triangular? For smaller sizes, mostly. As breasts are malleable, a triangular breast in all but the
flimsiest of clothes would be a small curve outward.
> > This screen is mostly just a lot of buttons to choose from lots of clothes options
> gonna end up the same mess as the current layout, it's -always- gonna be a million buttons. :\
A lot, yes. The same, no. By having a different screen for clothes parts gives those buttons practically
full screen estate, which means they can be substantially larger than they now are. My impression is they
are currently almost unusable, but on their own screen they would not be.
> but, I'll meet you half way and finally get around to naming all the buttons, so I can have them light up when you pick 'em.
Beware, you give me that and soon I'll suggest something silly like coloring those buttons with the color the item they
choose is, like hair and eye buttons already are
> > expanded the mess to have not only liquid but dust and cut type mess
> interesting.. it's not gonna be like the mess system, but I've been thinking about a 'temp' body layer for stuff like that.
> so, there'd be a layer for flowing water (shower?) battle damage, dust and stuff like that.
Since you had the mess color buttons I did play around with them. That led to thinking what other temporary things
characters could have. I just threw the idea in.
I see no reason why this temp body layer couldn't be used to show a somewhat sticky white-ish fluid.
...you could apply with a some kind of thing as your cursor by clicking on the woman. Hm, probably useless.
> > Male characters
> yeah, that's gotta happen sooner or later.
> when I'm ready for it, I'll get in contact with marune (or .. someone) from the simbro team..
> I'm sure they'll be happy to donate some art assets The amount of assets for males is maybe 1% of what you got for females, but it's a start.
Generally having male things in a game is nice unless you commit to Cephalopoda derivatives or a trips to eastern
Aegean Sea.
> > Should there be a way for other people to add hairstyles/clothes/other things?
> no idea how to make that work live, in-game.. not sure many would get much use outta it neither.
> but, I hope anyone who's got something cool will send it my way for me to add in (and I promise to stop butchering them now, too. honest. )
If not users, how about developers? Will you let others use your stuff in their games? Should one make a fantasy
game they might not want futuristic weapons and armor, instead adding bearded dwarf ladies and elf eyes...
>> Changes applied on hover, reverted unless clicked
> absolutely. 10/10. Just beware of problems if someone moves the cursor quickly over a row of buttons. Don't know how flash
does callbacks, but disabling the change on hover for 0.1 or 0.05 seconds whenever it's called might be an idea.
As I understand it you have different layers for different components?
So, for example, body accessories go to acc/body layer so when you alter your choice only that layer changes?
Is there an inherent reason in the graphics why you could not draw a tail to helmet layer?
If you could, you could have several generic layers, and a way to choose one.
This would allow people who like piercings to have 5 or tattoo lovers have loads of those and so on.
I suppose someone could choose 5 helmets, which would look silly but harm no-one. As they are layers,
any overlap would not be a problem.
All you would need is a radio button like set of buttons that choose the slot (layer) to edit.
> phew, I think I'm finally done .. I just hope any of that made sense
> thanks for the goodie-bag, z!
Any time. In fact, once we have some sort of vision on what will be included I'll likely make a new version.
Cheers,
Z.