Breeding Season Revival

[Coinicopia]

Hey - I was a little bit premature with the poll and pictures. Ignore it for now and look forward to a new one in the future! Maybe... I dunno. IGNORE ME!

[Hallucination]

Hey Everyone! Coin here, one of the artists working on this project and I'm just here to ask a question to our community and that is about the art 'style' you would like to see in this game. I don't want to spoil anything we're working on so I will be posting one related and one unrelated image and you can pick which one you like more - I know Valt is planning to put up a poll on this very subject sometime in the future but for now I want to give people a chance to see what their options will be. So, without further delay;

Valt/Jumbo

Spoiler (click to show/hide):

wolf_mating.png

Coin

Spoiler (click to show/hide):

monster.png

Spoiler (click to show/hide):

monsters.png

I don't think it's a fair comparison, since the Valt/Jumbo example seems to be fully colored and finished, while yours are more like sketches or concept art. They are very good, yes, but I don't think that the two styles can be directly compared. So yeah, not really sure which I'd like to see more.

[WonderGamer]

I attempted to contact H-Bomb on his blog about the revival of the game to see if he'd be interested in working with this new team, as I expect it's going to take ages rebuilding it from scratch. The statement on his blog was that he was scrapping it because his entire team left after S-Purple stabbed him in the back (my version of it, not his), so if he knows that a team is being formed to revive his game, perhaps he'll want to get back into developing it. Although I don't expect H-Bomb is going to even see the response (probably stopped checking it in July, being the last response to that blog), S-Purple really is known for his art-style, so I expect the main thing that would need to be done would be the art & animations would need to be redone, then the project could continue to be worked on from where it was when he dropped it (provided he still has the backups; the way he's talking, I can only image what he's going through to drop a game he's been working on for several years & would pretty well expect he's already trashed them).

[evildumdum]

I CANNOT STRESS THIS ENOUGH, H-BOMB MUST NEVER HAVE ANYTHING TO DO WITH THIS PROJECT!

The original breeding season failed because of his greed and lack of management skills. This new team is creating our own title and only loosely basing it on H-Bombs Breeding Season concept. We will never accept even so much as an endorsement from him. Our team is making steady progress and is improving greatly on the original concept which lacked direction.

I for one hate H-Bomb with a passion for his sheer contempt and laziness. Any attempt of his to influence this new project in any way will be stonewalled.

[WonderGamer]

I CANNOT STRESS THIS ENOUGH, H-BOMB MUST NEVER HAVE ANYTHING TO DO WITH THIS PROJECT!

The original breeding season failed because of his greed and lack of management skills. This new team is creating our own title and only loosely basing it on H-Bombs Breeding Season concept. We will never accept even so much as an endorsement from him. Our team is making steady progress and is improving greatly on the original concept which lacked direction.

I for one hate H-Bomb with a passion for his sheer contempt and laziness. Any attempt of his to influence this new project in any way will be stonewalled.

Your compassion & hatred towards the person that inspired the game you are trying to revive may have just lost you users that originally had interest in it. I don't expect H-Bomb will even see the message I left on his blog & rather than stating the reason for that all over again, you can check the response to your PM. I didn't want to say this, but your statement against him would imply that you aren't much better than S-Purple. I'm not trying to make enemies, but I don't sugarcoat what is obvious & for that reason I get the reputation of being extremely blunt, which you may be getting the impression of right now. Good luck on your game, I don't know that I'll be following it when your actions aren't far off from what S-Purple did.

I understand that H-Bomb was slower than most developers when it came to improving games, but one difference when it came to games on these forums was it didn't get dropped until somebody stabbed him in the back & for that I can understand his pain; while I also understand S-Purple's opinion on a project he had involvement on, taking the money, putting his art into the game, then using the added art as a threat of lawsuit against H-Bomb is one of the most corrupt schemes I've seen in the business world today, so H-Bomb may have gotten a rank of 4 out of 10 from me, S-Purple is at -1 out of 10.

Adios! Have fun trashing fans of the original game & see if the effort put into this revival ends up being worth it.

[evildumdum]

I CANNOT STRESS THIS ENOUGH, H-BOMB MUST NEVER HAVE ANYTHING TO DO WITH THIS PROJECT!

The original breeding season failed because of his greed and lack of management skills. This new team is creating our own title and only loosely basing it on H-Bombs Breeding Season concept. We will never accept even so much as an endorsement from him. Our team is making steady progress and is improving greatly on the original concept which lacked direction.

I for one hate H-Bomb with a passion for his sheer contempt and laziness. Any attempt of his to influence this new project in any way will be stonewalled.

Your compassion & hatred towards the person that inspired the game you are trying to revive may have just lost you users that originally had interest in it. I don't expect H-Bomb will even see the message I left on his blog & rather than stating the reason for that all over again, you can check the response to your PM. I didn't want to say this, but your statement against him would imply that you aren't much better than S-Purple. I'm not trying to make enemies, but I don't sugarcoat what is obvious & for that reason I get the reputation of being extremely blunt, which you may be getting the impression of right now. Good luck on your game, I don't know that I'll be following it when your actions aren't far off from what S-Purple did.

I understand that H-Bomb was slower than most developers when it came to improving games, but one difference when it came to games on these forums was it didn't get dropped until somebody stabbed him in the back & for that I can understand his pain; while I also understand S-Purple's opinion on a project he had involvement on, taking the money, putting his art into the game, then using the added art as a threat of lawsuit against H-Bomb is one of the most corrupt schemes I've seen in the business world today, so H-Bomb may have gotten a rank of 4 out of 10 from me, S-Purple is at -1 out of 10.

Adios! Have fun trashing fans of the original game & see if the effort put into this revival ends up being worth it.

I don't intend to and never have trashed fans of the original game at all. They were exceedingly patient. However if you are expecting Myself and my team to slave away doing H-Bombs dirty work while he sits atop his ivory tower then i'm afraid you are sadly misguided. If that puts you or anyone else off then i can't say i'm particularly upset.

I couldn't care less how desperately you want to drool over how much you love H-bomb. Nor do i care about or support S-Purple. I think both of them were dishonest and as bad as each other. As for your comparison of us to S-purple, you obviously have a very high opinion of yourself as a judge of others despite having zero knowledge of everything that happened up until this point. I suggest you read through everything in this thread before doling out your unfounded opinion. Kindly refrain from broadcasting your ignorance.

This thread was put together to recruit a team to create a game in the spirit of breeding season. I apologise if the title of the thread led you to believe otherwise, but this new project will be launched under it's own merit. Until then, Adios.

[VintageBass]

All right, so it'll probably be safer to not have H-Bomb on our team, more for not having some of the toxicity that came after the fallout of the original Breeding Season. It'll certainly be nice to have someone from the original game to help out, but with all that happened during that time period, it'll be better to start off with a clean slate and one that isn't going to get poisoned so easily. Whatever exactly happened between H-Bomb and S-Purple we don't want that to happen with our game. Which basically mean that whatever H-Bomb was doing during his time making the game, we don't want because it may slow down the progress being done already.

Also it'll be good to leave the recruitment to the team itself, not to outsiders. It's a nice gesture and all, but we would rather handle things ourselves, just to make sure that we can trust the people ourselves before adding them to the team.

[ValturNaa]

I CANNOT STRESS THIS ENOUGH, H-BOMB MUST NEVER HAVE ANYTHING TO DO WITH THIS PROJECT!

The original breeding season failed because of his greed and lack of management skills. This new team is creating our own title and only loosely basing it on H-Bombs Breeding Season concept. We will never accept even so much as an endorsement from him. Our team is making steady progress and is improving greatly on the original concept which lacked direction.

I for one hate H-Bomb with a passion for his sheer contempt and laziness. Any attempt of his to influence this new project in any way will be stonewalled.

Your compassion & hatred towards the person that inspired the game you are trying to revive may have just lost you users that originally had interest in it. I don't expect H-Bomb will even see the message I left on his blog & rather than stating the reason for that all over again, you can check the response to your PM. I didn't want to say this, but your statement against him would imply that you aren't much better than S-Purple. I'm not trying to make enemies, but I don't sugarcoat what is obvious & for that reason I get the reputation of being extremely blunt, which you may be getting the impression of right now. Good luck on your game, I don't know that I'll be following it when your actions aren't far off from what S-Purple did.

I understand that H-Bomb was slower than most developers when it came to improving games, but one difference when it came to games on these forums was it didn't get dropped until somebody stabbed him in the back & for that I can understand his pain; while I also understand S-Purple's opinion on a project he had involvement on, taking the money, putting his art into the game, then using the added art as a threat of lawsuit against H-Bomb is one of the most corrupt schemes I've seen in the business world today, so H-Bomb may have gotten a rank of 4 out of 10 from me, S-Purple is at -1 out of 10.

Adios! Have fun trashing fans of the original game & see if the effort put into this revival ends up being worth it.

Another private opinion here but damn, man. What kind of person do you have to be to act *on our behalf* without even coming to us to ask if we want you to? Next time you get a brilliant idea about something we should do, ask first, please.

As far as bringing H-bomb onto the team, I agree with dumdum. H-bomb wasn't merely slow. He was lazy, greedy, and careless. I must assume he was in charge of what little story they had, because it never changed a jot since they first penned it and the later events were...ugh. Do you remember the alpha dickwolf event? Animation was good but the dialog was literally blah blah blah. From what we know about the inner workings of the team, his only production job was coding, and while the art and animation made slow but steady progress, the code stalled out about halfway through the project (and what little was done was the work of a contracted coder, not H-bomb). To be honest, I think H-bomb lost interest in his own project and it only lived as long as it did because he had other people who cared enough to do his damn job for him. S-Purple finally got fed up and cut his losses, and Vanilly gave up and moved on. H-Bomb used them leaving as an excuse to drop it like a hot potato and take all the profits he stole from loyal fans who expected a finished product. Bummer on all of you who paid into that scam, but who cares? With a little care, he can live off of those profits for years and build something else when that runs out, right?

Seriously, ask before you act for others. Surprising people with something is like giving christmas presents. First you have to have an idea what the person likes. A pet tarantula for an arachnophobe is far, far from a good present. It might be a good prank but if you like that person you better have something damn good planned to make up for it.

[WonderGamer]

I see this is turning into a revolution here, but whatever, let's get down to the replies:

I don't intend to and never have trashed fans of the original game at all. They were exceedingly patient. However if you are expecting Myself and my team to slave away doing H-Bombs dirty work while he sits atop his ivory tower then i'm afraid you are sadly misguided. If that puts you or anyone else off then i can't say i'm particularly upset.

I'm not saying you should work under H-Bomb, especially if he was as slow at managing the game as the users led me to believe (going by the statement of the users in the original thread, not particularly yours because I'm getting so much toxic opinionated propaganda that it's obvious hatred towards him has built into a overbearing pit of pure rage).

You state the patience of the users, while perhaps I was one of the most patient given there was a version that at least worked (minus some animations, it was the one uploaded on these forums), so I had something to occupy my time while he worked on a fully functional update (not necessarily Breeding Season; I haven't played it in a few months & somewhat lost interest when I found the project crashed & burned), however I will say that 2 years to release a fully functional update was beyond absurd (the only thing that lessens the blow against him is there was updates to the game happening & I've seen some of those versions, however they were never as stable as the one uploaded to LoK). The reason for lack of functional updates, we shouldn't really be judging that or making assumptions, as most people code flash as a hobby (unless a web developer) & if somebody gets a job that takes of the time to continue that hobby, that's going to interfere seeing further updates.

If you're saying I can't understand the pain of the users who patiently waited for an update, you're wrong, as I was one that did mention on occasion (longer than most) where there was a lack of updates to the game, but I didn't get downright irate about it. Also I can fully understand those that chose to fund the game being the most upset about it even before the game itself crashed & burned, with only the hatred towards the dead (hopefully not; still hoping he'll pick it up sooner or later, so those who paid into the game don't get stiffed) project fueling the fire to the point the "clash of sides" may never end & could very well spread like a virus over the internet, further poisoning the project regardless of who puts it out & what title it takes.

I couldn't care less how desperately you want to drool over how much you love H-bomb. Nor do i care about or support S-Purple. I think both of them were dishonest and as bad as each other.

I am no more a fan of H-Bomb than I am of S-Purple after he dropped the project & left all those that paid into the game in the dust; while I can't exactly state I fully agree with your judgmental assumptions of his character, I do agree that leaving those that funded the game in the dust was a despicable act & one that would show I would never fund a project he's doing. Likewise, I would never fund a project that S-Purple was doing due to his obvious deceit when Breeding Season turned into a roaring flame of pure rage that has bled over to those that had any interest in the game.

What I can say about H-Bomb is I recognize his skill for making a decent game (spending most of my career in the technical field, a lot of it as a Computer Technician, even if I wasn't being paid for the majority of that work & having minimal programming experience, but even the little experience I had was enough to acknowledge his skill in making a complex game such as this), where most flash games (even some full-blown, big name, RPG games) do not go to the extent Breeding Season did.

While I do blame H-Bomb for stiffing those that paid into it, I don't entirely put the blame on him for it's ultimate demise, as it's obvious S-Purple played a VERY BIG part in that & the Patreon page was the kicker where I think H-Bomb had every right to drop it (or go after S-Purple with legal prosecution, as is what I would have done), I'm just not impressed (alright, I'm disgusted) with the fact he gave the finger to all those funding the game when it got dropped, but S-Purple also played a part in that given he's not only taken the money & ran, he's using that as leverage to gain further funding on Cloud Meadow by crediting that contribution to the stolen project. This only proves why funding an unfinished project is a risky investment regardless of who's developing it & Starcraft Ghost (being traded to EA for one of their games to save the project when Blizzard canceled it, only to be dropped by EA later on & the game never saw the light of day) would be an example of how even big name companies can't always finish what they started.

As for your comparison of us to S-purple...

I won't address the rest of that malarkey, so it's been removed from the quote.

The "comparison", as you put it, isn't that different. Let's look at the facts:

What has been done by both S-Purple & this team:

• Both games are being re-titled using mechanics from the original game.
• Both games are removing credit from the original developer, not even giving credit as being an inspiration to their remakes (at least this is what your comments have lead me to believe, not seeing anything on your remake thus far, so whether any credit has been or will be given is undetermined).
• As per your own comments, you would refuse the original developer to join your team, as is expected to have happened with S-Purple.

What is still undetermined:

• S-Purple started a new Patreon to gain funds for the stolen material on Cloud Meadow, continuing to gain funds on it in addition to the money gained through Breeding Season, using the stolen art that was already paid for through funding of Breeding Season before S-Purple issued a legal threat against H-Bomb if he continued the project & the ultimate demise of what happened to Breeding Season.
  
  • The undetermined part of this is whether you're intending on also gaining fan funding such as H-Bomb & S-Purple was doing, as this is going to put you into that same category at S-Purple, although not quite to that extent seeing as it appears there was ill intentions from S-Purple, if not from the start, but at least a month (possibly more) prior to the shutdown of Breeding Season.

How are you different from S-Purple:

• You didn't cause the downfall (sabotage) of Breeding Seasons.
• You didn't start the remake until after the project was already dead.
• As per your own statement via PM, you're using RenPy rather than Flash, however it seems this was a deterrent to making sure H-Bomb wouldn't want to join your project (although it would be amusing if H-Bomb had that experience & it didn't faze him, however I think he wants to be done with it based on his own statements & probably won't ever know about this revival; I actually fear he may have done something for which he won't be able to come back from...don't ask me to elaborate), which is one step that S-Purple didn't do & perhaps the one detail on a different scale that further lowers the reputation of your new team.

Things to consider:

• If you use graphics created by S-Purple, he's going to come after you with a lawsuit.
• If you make a complete copy of Breeding Season (including layout, mechanics & so on), H-Bomb could potentially come after you with a lawsuit (if he has any interest in pursuing the project in the future).
• H-Bomb may consider picking up Breeding Season in the future, but it's going to take a lot of cleanup of what S-Purple has put into the game or a class-action lawsuit against him claiming legal rights to content that was paid for before he'll be able to do that.
  
  • Cloud Meadow already has a reputation for being a ripoff after the fallout between the two & the fear of those considering paying into it with the potential of a lawsuit against S-Purple has deterred a good amount of interested people from becoming a Patron. Cloud Meadow been altered enough that S-Purple might be able to get away with it if he changes the mechanics far enough to the point there aren't any similarities between the two (there's still the potential for a lawsuit for stolen content, but H-Bomb may not win that if altered enough & there isn't any proof left of the stolen code).
  • Considering you are using a different platform for your game, you've already dropped the possibility of lawsuit based on a possible claim of decompiling Breeding Seasons & importing it into your own, however if the layout & mechanics are too similar, he might still have that option. You're going to want to alter the game enough that H-Bomb won't be able to go after you with a lawsuit or at least won't win it if he does pursue that route.
  • As is the case with Patrons on Cloud Meadow (with the potential of a lawsuit against S-Purple), consider the fact that if you attempt to get fan-funding for your project, you may run into the same problems with fear of litigation in response to a claimed ripoff of Breeding Season (that will only warrant a larger loss as well should H-Bomb go through with it). If you aren't intending on getting fan-funding for the game, then it is unlikely H-Bomb will be able to get much, if anything from you should he attempt to litigate.

This thread was put together to recruit a team to create a game in the spirit of breeding season. I apologise if the title of the thread led you to believe otherwise, but this new project will be launched under it's own merit. Until then, Adios.

Yes the confusion was there, but the details regarding that has been sorted out via your PM. However you state "in the spirit of breeding season", but that usually would mean you would give credit to original game in the credits/opening, where it seems your hatred towards H-Bomb likely won't allow you to do that...

@VintageBass,
Given you didn't get downright nasty with your responses, I will actually take your response seriously, as apposed to some of the vile responses dripping malice I've gotten so far.

All right, so it'll probably be safer to not have H-Bomb on our team, more for not having some of the toxicity that came after the fallout of the original Breeding Season. It'll certainly be nice to have someone from the original game to help out, but with all that happened during that time period, it'll be better to start off with a clean slate and one that isn't going to get poisoned so easily. Whatever exactly happened between H-Bomb and S-Purple we don't want that to happen with our game. Which basically mean that whatever H-Bomb was doing during his time making the game, we don't want because it may slow down the progress being done already.

Ironically, pursuing the revival of Breeding Season still has that poisonous air about it & will likely affect this game in one way or another. I agree that it would probably be smart not to work with either one of them & from a personal perspective, those who would want to fund their projects should steer clear of it; likewise, as I stated before in this post, that could also effect funding on this game (if your team decides to do it) in fear of a potential lawsuit that may bleed over to this remake.

Also it'll be good to leave the recruitment to the team itself, not to outsiders. It's a nice gesture and all, but we would rather handle things ourselves, just to make sure that we can trust the people ourselves before adding them to the team.

That was an error on my part & something I should have apologized for when it was first brought up in response to my message, but the toxic nature of evildumdum's response (sure hope he isn't the leader of this team, as that's only going to solidify my loss of interest in this remake, as was the case last night when I realized his rage towards H-Bomb was apparently effecting rationality to see the full picture, although he has already proved he has a better understanding about it than most despite his obvious hatred towards the two that has caused this commotion), I wasn't interested in giving an apology of any sort, so for your sake & your rational response, I will apologize now (it wasn't my intentions to "speak for" the new team, only that I felt H-Bomb should be aware of it as perhaps it would remotivate him into picking up the original project; I'm already attempting to push him into suing S-Purple for the obvious sabotage of Breeding Season).

I'm trying to consider the views of everybody involved:

• H-Bomb for getting screwed over by S-Purple.
• S-Purple's drive for why he did it in the first place.
• Those that got screwed over funding Breeding Season when it got killed, not only by H-Bomb, but also by S-Purple (although S-Purple's path seems to be more sinister than H-Bomb's).
• Those that weren't funding it anxiously (and in some cases, patiently) waiting a new fully-functional update to the game).

One other thing to consider is how Patreon has gotten caught in the middle of this. It's not something I've thought a lot about, but consider all those that funded the game (especially if you consider the monetary value that H-Bomb has thrown out) that lashed back at Patreon when Breeding seasons got killed off. Then consider those that are still retaliating to Patreon in response to the new funding page for Cloud Meadow. There have likely been a lot of lawsuit threats (and possibly even some that have went through with it) against Patreon, who is perhaps the most reputable of any that were involved in the creation of Breeding Season (not technically, but financially), where this is also going to tarnish their reputation for the fallen through project & allowing funding of the ripoff project.

Another private opinion here but damn, man. What kind of person do you have to be to act *on our behalf* without even coming to us to ask if we want you to? Next time you get a brilliant idea about something we should do, ask first, please.

Seriously, ask before you act for others. Surprising people with something is like giving christmas presents. First you have to have an idea what the person likes. A pet tarantula for an arachnophobe is far, far from a good present. It might be a good prank but if you like that person you better have something damn good planned to make up for it.

I've already addressed these statements, read above

As far as bringing H-bomb onto the team, I agree with dumdum. H-bomb wasn't merely slow. He was lazy, greedy, and careless.

I think these statements are exaggerated & out of line:

• Slow was a given, more so than most developers, but "lazy" would be a personal assumption by those who don't realize life can interfere with our plans to finish what we've started. While we have no proof as to what prevented him from getting fully-functional updates out, what we do know is he would go long periods without hearing from him, so other than being ludicrously slow on getting updates out, we can't really make a judgment of his personality if we don't have the facts.
• Greedy I can't say I agree with, but I do find it despicable that he didn't consider those that helped fund the project. To some degree, it's understandable since as S-Purple took a good portion of it & ran, which means H-Bomb wouldn't be able to refund that money unless he took thousands of dollars out of his own wallet that S-Purple took off with. While statement of those following Cloud Meadow are saying he's counting contributions to Breeding Season towards Cloud Meadow, the previous actions of S-Purple makes me believe this is more of a devious marketing-tactic to gain funding for Cloud Meadow rather than being a reputable action of remorse. If anybody is greedy, S-Purple should have it carved right into his forhead...
• H-Bomb was only careless in bringing S-Purple on to work with him & giving him a large portion of the Patreon contributions. His coding wasn't careless, as the complexity of the game would have had him drop the game fairly early if he was careless about coding it & unable to fix what he caused. I don't know if there's any relevance towards it, but the possibility that there was something breaking the game that he was trying to fix may have been part of the reason why a fully-functional build was released since 2014.

I must assume he was in charge of what little story they had, because it never changed a jot since they first penned it and the later events were...ugh. Do you remember the alpha dickwolf event? Animation was good but the dialog was literally blah blah blah.

I noticed the "blah blah blah" text when I tried out a beta from his blog briefly, but didn't go beyond that as I came back to the version on these forums since I was more interested in full-functionality (even if it was missing some animations) than better graphics with broken functionality, so the Alpha Dickwolf is not something I'm aware of (honestly I've been attempting to find a download for v7.7.1 since yesterday to see if there was any improvement in functionality on newer versions). I would not be surprised if the "blah blah blah" text was actually part of the sabotage from S-Purple...

To be honest, I think H-bomb lost interest in his own project...

Removing the rest of that statement as I think it's malarkey, but I think it is very possible that H-Bomb did lose interest in his own project, therefore severely cutting the time he spent on it. One thing I noticed from the original thread on these forums was there was those that were complaining about lack of content added to the game that he supposedly promised them for being a contributor to the project; I would expect the constant bickering towards the slow nature of updates may have pushed him into not caring about it, however this doesn't exactly work in his favor when he's using fan-funding to keep it going.

S-Purple finally got fed up and cut his losses,

There was hardly any loss in this for S-Purple, he took money for his work, threatened a lawsuit against H-Bomb if he continued the project with his art & appears to be using the same art in Cloud Meadow (maybe with some slight alterations, but it's art that H-Bomb paid for & he took that with him also); he came out ahead, although it was done through sabotage & extortion. The person that would have taken a loss in this would have been H-Bomb would he have continued to work on it, which doesn't make it entirely surprising he dropped it. However seeing that the project got dropped, now the people taking the loss was those that were funding it, so it doesn't matter how you look at it, S-Purple came out ahead, everybody else took the fall for it (including Patreon given I can only expect the harassment they are getting over the whole ordeal; see above for further information).

and Vanilly gave up and moved on.

I don't know too much regarding this, but my understanding was she was the original artist, correct? If that's the case, I can understand why she wanted to leave the team when S-Purple was brought on as the new artist/animator.

H-Bomb used them leaving as an excuse to drop it like a hot potato and take all the profits he stole from loyal fans who expected a finished product.

I think H-Bomb has a valid excuse (personally I would have pursued it in court), especially with the legal threat from S-Purple (extortion) & no longer having a team; while I do believe S-Purple screwing them may have played a part in the project being dropped, I only expect that was the last straw, not the entirety of why they left. He could remove the graphics provided by S-Purple, get a new team (if needed) & continue working on the game, however he'll be losing a lot of time removing that content & having it replaced, he's already taken quite the loss due to the extortion from S-Purple & at this point it's unlikely anybody will help him fund the game further, so perhaps he was right to drop it, but I still would have taken S-Purple to court over it to get back the money that was paid into the project & punitive damages for being the straw that broke the camels back & killed Breeding Season (at least it's playable offline & from your own drive, so older versions are still playable). What I don't condone is the fact that everybody who previously paid into Breeding Seasons got a hefty "F*** YOU!!!", so while perhaps understandable to a point, it still doesn't warrant any values that I would consider funding his projects lucrative.

---

tl;dr? Fine, suit yourself. Those unwilling to read this, be aware you're giving the finger to roughly 4 hours of detailed responses, where I have been working on this post from about 12:30 PM to 4:30 PM.

[shames90210]

OH chaos gods be damned even khorne wouldn't approve of this almost aimless aggression. (Yes I have read the entire conversation, no I'm not a part of the team anymore but I can still have my opinion and state it hear I accept any incoming flames) As far as I can see no one (other then cory's very credible attempt) has handled this entire conversation in a reasonable manner.

To the AoB Team, one huge thing to remember is that despite any personal feelings on the subject the is and always will be both a valid reason to have H-bomb involved even in a very remote capacity and for the old game fans to want him to be apart of whatever brainchild may have arisen from his work. Keeping in mind everything that happened with Breeding season a vast vast amount of work was done by H-bomb long before other people started to (and I say this very tentatively) spoiled the broth.

Like with most things that happen behind closed doors we'll never fully know what truly happened that finally ended the project but there are a ton and I mean a ton of variable that can't be accounted for right now.

As for keeping H-bomb out of the game you probably won't have to worry about that since I had tried contacting him back before the group was finalised and still haven't received a response so its safe to say hes stopped caring.

However and I say this with love, after having read the entirety of this page so far I can definitely gauge that some people will have been put off of the project, its to no fault of anyone here either on the team of otherwise. Shit happens, keeping moving forward.

To WonderGamer, While I can see the innocence of trying to "recruit" or as I understood it simply get someone to look into something, the team is right in that it may have overstepped some boundaries and stepped on a few toes. Things like this will always be touchy some teams may enjoy an outsider taking enough of an active interest to try and bring new attention to a project while others may not. As I stated above however I believe the H-bomb ship set sail long ago and sadly it seems like he either doesn't feel like hes capable of coming back from everything or doesn't care to try.

Personally I hope that this whole endeavour hasn't caused you to fully lose faith in the project as I can from first hand experience say there is a lot of talent working on this project and it has the potential to be very successful and enjoyable for its fans.

To everyone who may read this, Fans of breeding season or not, hopefully you all can look past the apparent hostility and aggression and continue to see whats going on here as a viable outlet for your free time. While I can't speak for anyone who has been apart of this I would be shocked to believe that anyone meant to offend or upset anyone and this was merely a small case of misunderstandings turning into arguments.

Love and best wishes,
Shames90210

[VintageBass]

Thank you for taking your time out to show some concerns for the game, and your words have been heard. I can assure you that we are taking every bit of precaution with this game and are looking to improve upon what has been made before. We are aiming to create a new experience using new assets, building on a new engine and hopefully bring something entirely new to the table. We are going to be as transparent as possible with this game to let everyone know about what kind of game we're making and what exactly is going into it, and we will be listening to feedback to help improve the game to help satisfy everyone.

Just be patient for a little while longer as we are still working on a playable demo for the public to play. I would much rather have the game speak for itself and then for you to judge it based off our words. There are certain aspects that we can't ignore, but this is just how making games goes at times. Please do not let your previous experiences cloud your judgment for our game, we're simply wanting to create a fun game for the public to enjoy.

Again, thank you for your time, have a nice day.

[Lucky777]

putting his art into the game, then using the added art as a threat of lawsuit against H-Bomb is one of the most corrupt schemes I've seen in the business world today, so H-Bomb may have gotten a rank of 4 out of 10 from me, S-Purple is at -1 out of 10.

[...]

• H-Bomb was only careless in bringing S-Purple on to work with him & giving him a large portion of the Patreon contributions.

I don't really give a fuck about this drama, and I'm hoping the various breeding games including Cloud Meadow do well, but I do want your perspective on two things.

If you're involved enough in the subject to have knowledge of it, and invested enough in it to take 4 hours typing a post, I feel like answering these should take you only a few seconds.

I could scroll back in the thread to see if the answers are already there, but while I care enough to ask, I legitimately don't care enough to take the time to read back and do that.

---

1) Isn't it the case that S-purple's control over his art was expressly spelled out in the contract H-bomb agreed to?
If it is, then H-bomb's carelessness was only in agreeing to the contract.
Enforcing a lawful contract is not theft.

2) Isn't it the case that H-bomb could just replace the Art and animations and continue on, with very minimal effort?
Coding is wizardry, but is there any reason H-bomb couldn't just have used the existing coding and slotted in new art + anims?
It seems to me like it would be easy.

Real easy.

Once he got an artist and animator, anyhow.

So there'd be no need at all to shut down the project just because he lawfully lost access to S-Purple's art.

---

I don't know anything about flash animations so what "seems to me" could be wrong.
But the Old Huntsman's games can have fanmade art-packs, and they don't take too long to make and switch to your liking.
Now, surely animations are more involved to make than static pictures.
But it does seem like it'd be a relatively simple endeavour to switch stuff out.
*shrugs*

If your response to my not caring enough to investigate on my own is your not caring enough to answer, I don't blame you, but in case you answer, I'm grateful.

[Ungawa]

Okay, just to get this back on track... I'm interested in this project and what others do with this. I'm waiting for the demo. As it stands, others can have their own version of the BS idea and do what they want. I'll play and assess and criticize those games based on their merits.

For example, I like what Goth is doing with his demon version in his own space. I HOPE that the crew here is doing their own thing and not getting bogged down by the drama that's recently risen up and just focusing on making a good game that allows me to farm as well as possibly fight without one thing overshadowing another.

Not like you can't play Resident Evil and Silent Hill. You just can't play them at the same time. So I'll wait for what people do with THIS before giving an okay, a yay, or a nay on how this is. I have high expectations for this crew. I have high expectations on other games to not be abandoned. *shrugs*

So I'll just say, keep up the work and I'm watching like a hawk for what this crew does.

[BigBrianIsLarge]

im so so so glad someone is "remaking the game" in fact, id like to help. not that i know that i could sadly.

anyway somthing id like to see changed, is more variety in monsters. instead of there being 10 monsters (including humans) maybe have more like 30 monsters.
i dont know anything about coding all that in, but thats what id like to see

[ValturNaa]

That is something I personally would like to see also, if we can sort out the logistical problems involved with it. But it isn't coding that becomes the problem (that's just a matter of creating a few new classes inheriting from the general monster class). It's the sheer volume of drawing and animation involved. Particularly if you're using multiple variations of each monster. Every one one of those parts needs to be sketched, colored, and shaded in every possible form it might be seen in, and depending on the methods used to animate it, that could be a lot of variations. And then, it all has to be animated. Needless to say, that is a *lot* of work to get involved in, and we have only two people working on it right now. So, yeah. If we sort out the logistical problems and find we can expand the monster list, we'll look into it. Meanwhile, don't expect too many types.

[Ungawa]

That is something I personally would like to see also, if we can sort out the logistical problems involved with it. But it isn't coding that becomes the problem (that's just a matter of creating a few new classes inheriting from the general monster class). It's the sheer volume of drawing and animation involved. Particularly if you're using multiple variations of each monster. Every one one of those parts needs to be sketched, colored, and shaded in every possible form it might be seen in, and depending on the methods used to animate it, that could be a lot of variations. And then, it all has to be animated. Needless to say, that is a *lot* of work to get involved in, and we have only two people working on it right now. So, yeah. If we sort out the logistical problems and find we can expand the monster list, we'll look into it. Meanwhile, don't expect too many types.

That kind of makes me want to see how many you all want in the first place though. I'd expect 5-8 just to have proof of concept. You can change them around later, but that at least seems plausible and manageable with the resources you all have.

[waterdrop]

tbh it was meant to fail sooner or later, they kept delaying things and the few updates were almost unnoticeable.

[evildumdum]

That is something I personally would like to see also, if we can sort out the logistical problems involved with it. But it isn't coding that becomes the problem (that's just a matter of creating a few new classes inheriting from the general monster class). It's the sheer volume of drawing and animation involved. Particularly if you're using multiple variations of each monster. Every one one of those parts needs to be sketched, colored, and shaded in every possible form it might be seen in, and depending on the methods used to animate it, that could be a lot of variations. And then, it all has to be animated. Needless to say, that is a *lot* of work to get involved in, and we have only two people working on it right now. So, yeah. If we sort out the logistical problems and find we can expand the monster list, we'll look into it. Meanwhile, don't expect too many types.

That kind of makes me want to see how many you all want in the first place though. I'd expect 5-8 just to have proof of concept. You can change them around later, but that at least seems plausible and manageable with the resources you all have.

I'm afraid you have no idea what our rescources are and what is plausible. Your target of 5-8 monsters for proof of concept is absurd. That is a MINIMUM of 91 breeding animations plus everything else that goes along with it. Breeding season only just had 8 monsters after 4 years of development and hundreds of thousands of $ capital. We are a six man team working with zero funding right now and whatever spare time we have after work. I'm happy that you have high expectations but you need to ground them a little or you will be disappointed.

[Lucky777]

I'm afraid you have no idea what our rescources are and what is plausible. Your target of 5-8 monsters for proof of concept is absurd. That is a MINIMUM of 91 breeding animations plus everything else that goes along with it. Breeding season only just had 8 monsters after 4 years of development and hundreds of thousands of $ capital. We are a six man team working with zero funding right now and whatever spare time we have after work. I'm happy that you have high expectations but you need to ground them a little or you will be disappointed.

Wait what?

How d'you figure that?

Each monster can be either male or female, so let's say that means 5 monsters is REALLY like ... 10 unique things.

Out of 10 unique things the number of unique pairs should be 10 X (10 - 1) over 2.

That's not 91, that's 45.

Even when you throw in "monster and self" pairs, which would... I don't know... add 10 more animations? that's only 55.
Add Solo stuff for another 10 and get to 65.
This is not 91.

Only if you want to go even further beyond, and say "each monster can be either dominant or submissive" would you break 90 with something like 230.

If you want to throw in futa without just using male animations then yeah, that adds more, but 5 monsters with futa starts at 105 before same-species and solo stuff.

Though yes, JUST 8 monsters plugged into that formula does give the startling minimum of 152 animations without futa and before dom/sub.

[evildumdum]

I'm afraid you have no idea what our rescources are and what is plausible. Your target of 5-8 monsters for proof of concept is absurd. That is a MINIMUM of 91 breeding animations plus everything else that goes along with it. Breeding season only just had 8 monsters after 4 years of development and hundreds of thousands of $ capital. We are a six man team working with zero funding right now and whatever spare time we have after work. I'm happy that you have high expectations but you need to ground them a little or you will be disappointed.

Wait what?

How d'you figure that?

Each monster can be either male or female, so let's say that means 5 monsters is REALLY like ... 10 unique things.

Out of 10 unique things the number of unique pairs should be 10 X (10 - 1) over 2.

That's not 91, that's 45.

Even when you throw in "monster and self" pairs, which would... I don't know... add 10 more animations? that's only 55.
Add Solo stuff for another 10 and get to 65.
This is not 91.

Only if you want to go even further beyond, and say "each monster can be either dominant or submissive" would you break 90 with something like 230.

If you want to throw in futa without just using male animations then yeah, that adds more, but 5 monsters with futa starts at 105 before same-species and solo stuff.

Though yes, JUST 8 monsters plugged into that formula does give the startling minimum of 152 animations without futa and before dom/sub.

Mine was an offhand calculation so i appreciate your maths (and references, loved the even further). But it does stand to show the absurdity of starting with 5-8 monsters. We only have 2 artists and they both have jobs like the rest of us. That sort of workload would be insane.