Despair Labyrinth (RPG) Latest Release: Ver.0.09 (4/18/12)

[SpectralTime]

I was curious, so I opened up DebugMode and did Lanie's sidequest, just to see what would happen. I figured that, as much as I dislike Lanie, it might be worth playing.

Comments:

First, this is going to be impossible to find. I know that I've never come back to the bar room after beating the X-meister, and having that as a precondition needlessly obscures and adds pointless backtracking to an already pointless backtracking-heavy quest.

Second... Well, yeah, the pointless backtracking. Even WITH DebugMode teleportation, it got REAL old REAL fast.

Third, the plot-relevant information was... interesting, to say the least, though I'm not sure about the incredible specificity with which it pinpoints Lanie. That "top of her class" bit in particular stuck out.

Fourth, I liked the conversation mini-game. I did it once while roleplaying and once with foreknowledge of the right answers to experiment, and found that it was nicely forgiving and relatively easy even if you play her as I understand her character.

Fifth, the sex scene was, paradoxically, rather a favorite of mine, with its high degree of interactivity and generally sex-positive "action." I liked it a lot, is what I'm getting at, and considering I usually find Lanie ALMOST as annoying as an ACTUAL teenage girl, that's saying something.

Sixth, here's how I'd fix it. Since the books you have to find are already arranged as you'd find them on a trek through the dungeon,
a) have Lanie activate the quest immediately after defeating the sailors
b) have Lanie teleport automatically back and fourth between wherever she found the book and sitting next to Renford in the bar
and
c) make the prophecy a little less ridiculously specific so you can modify it to include whichever girls you need... unless Renford WAS just trying to butter her up.

(...I'm not sure if I'd be any more attracted to buttered Lanie than I am regular Lanie.)

In short, the quest as a whole is a good idea with somewhat clumsy and annoying execution and a fine, enjoyable conclusion. If nothing else, it ALMOST made me want to pick up Lanie for a play-through, and considering my distaste for her character and annoying "valley girl" speaking pattern, that's really saying something. Wonder if she and the girls from the Arcane Division all know each other. Nebula, at least, SOUNDS like her.

[Savyar]

is it possible to get 2 widowmakers or is only 1 availible

[KITAmaru]

Bwah, you shoulda told me this during the actual testing period! I would've instantly made it so that she teleports straight back. But eh, I was feeling like a dick and wanted to make people work for it, but in the end you're right--I should probably do that whole teleportation thing in the next patch to avoid too much hate. As for the Xanrud arc being over with as a requirement, I really didn't want to start a romance with this guy and then be like OHI GWYN... not that Gwyn isn't a third wheel throughout that whole quest anyway if she's in it (in b4 complaints, I do what I can), buut just sayin', I felt it might uh, ruin the moment per se, as I'm aware that people can get attached to the duelist from Aelwyck.

Pluuuus, the wiki should help and what not, anyhow.
And yeah, we'll be having a run-in with one of the Trouble 5 next patch, as it is the entry into the Arcane Division.

There's only one Widowmaker available thus far; Xanrud does NOT drop it if you beat him while rescuing Gwyn from the Chambers. Only if you manage to defeat him the first time will you be able to get it.

Also Starke, thanks for the help. I saw your update on the wiki's walkthrough and that looks AMAZING! Keep up the good work!
I'll also fix your name in the credits for the next patch.

[StarkePT]

I was curious, so I opened up DebugMode and did Lanie's sidequest, just to see what would happen. I figured that, as much as I dislike Lanie, it might be worth playing.

Comments:

First, this is going to be impossible to find. I know that I've never come back to the bar room after beating the X-meister, and having that as a precondition needlessly obscures and adds pointless backtracking to an already pointless backtracking-heavy quest.

Second... Well, yeah, the pointless backtracking. Even WITH DebugMode teleportation, it got REAL old REAL fast.

Third, the plot-relevant information was... interesting, to say the least, though I'm not sure about the incredible specificity with which it pinpoints Lanie. That "top of her class" bit in particular stuck out.

Fourth, I liked the conversation mini-game. I did it once while roleplaying and once with foreknowledge of the right answers to experiment, and found that it was nicely forgiving and relatively easy even if you play her as I understand her character.

Fifth, the sex scene was, paradoxically, rather a favorite of mine, with its high degree of interactivity and generally sex-positive "action." I liked it a lot, is what I'm getting at, and considering I usually find Lanie ALMOST as annoying as an ACTUAL teenage girl, that's saying something.

Sixth, here's how I'd fix it. Since the books you have to find are already arranged as you'd find them on a trek through the dungeon,
a) have Lanie activate the quest immediately after defeating the sailors
b) have Lanie teleport automatically back and fourth between wherever she found the book and sitting next to Renford in the bar
and
c) make the prophecy a little less ridiculously specific so you can modify it to include whichever girls you need... unless Renford WAS just trying to butter her up.

(...I'm not sure if I'd be any more attracted to buttered Lanie than I am regular Lanie.)

In short, the quest as a whole is a good idea with somewhat clumsy and annoying execution and a fine, enjoyable conclusion. If nothing else, it ALMOST made me want to pick up Lanie for a play-through, and considering my distaste for her character and annoying "valley girl" speaking pattern, that's really saying something. Wonder if she and the girls from the Arcane Division all know each other. Nebula, at least, SOUNDS like her.

You kids nowadays are used to have everything done for you, no offense, but the backtrack is NOT that heavy.

I just feel that games nowadays have no difficulty or are really addictive, it's all graphics. I miss the OLD gaming days. (Old as in 20 years ago, not: "ohmagaaad so old when Zelda Ocarina of time came out"). If you had to do the backtrack every time you wanted to finish the game it would be annoying, but you don't, you have to do it once to unlock an H-Scene, or maybe it's just simple for me because I know the Labyrinth like the palm of my hand and doesn't feel that huge for me anymore, either way.

is it possible to get 2 widowmakers or is only 1 availible

The only weapons you can get 2 from (without shopping) is Katzbalger and Swordbreaker.

[KITAmaru]

Haha, well, I already know a few people who I've pissed off with the quest, but eh... XD
Mm, the second incarnation of Xanrud (the 3500 HP one who you need to fight to rescue Gwyn from the Chambers) drops a Swordbreaker and a Rapier instead of a Swordbreaker and a Widowmaker by chance. So unless there's some kinda bug I'm missing (yet again...) I don't think you can get two Widowmakers.

[StarkePT]

Haha, well, I already know a few people who I've pissed off with the quest, but eh... XD
Mm, the second incarnation of Xanrud (the 3500 HP one who you need to fight to rescue Gwyn from the Chambers) drops a Swordbreaker and a Rapier instead of a Swordbreaker and a Widowmaker by chance. So unless there's some kinda bug I'm missing (yet again...) I don't think you can get two Widowmakers.

Yeah rechecked it real quick, the design of Widowmaker and Swordbreaker are real similar that's what made me think otherwise.

Well a man can only test so far, even with 20 or so people in your beta team some bugs still come out, I played the game from start to finish so many times and didn't found some, you shouldn't take it so hard on yourself

[Seleph129]

Is it me or download of DLaby with RTP is broken? It says file Heal2.png is corrupt and freezes unpacking.

[SpectralTime]

...Dude. SPT? Are you seriously playing the "kids these days" card? If there's a scene that an enourmous chunk of the playerbase will never ever see because it's been buried too deeply into the game to find and has such a high annoyance factor that people won't like it, doesn't that lower the objective quality of the game? Don't tell me you LIKE having to walk back and fourth through three quarters of the game thus far! Eiji, Rei, even Fouron would be ashamed!

Maybe I'm spoiled. I'm currently trying out another RPGMaker game called Harem, which, despite its MANY, many objective flaws, DOES teleport you around when you finish part of a quest instead of making you hoof it back and fourth across half the map for no reason.

As to him popping up before Gwen... eh? I don't get it. I mean, you run into Orpheus AND Wolfram first anyway, and Lanie says both of them are hot too. If the player wants to go after Gwen, they'll go after Gwen. If they don't (and, if I don't feel it fits the character I'm playing, I don't) then they won't. There's no beating the quest BEFORE you have that chance ANYWAY.

Have mercy. If you don't take any of my advice about "backtracking" for the rest of the quest, at least alter the trigger so you don't need to beat X-man to start it. Otherwise... well, some people don't like using guides to get through games, and there's a whole TvTropes page full of stuff people complain practically NEEDS a guide to get through.

[StarkePT]

...Dude. SPT? Are you seriously playing the "kids these days" card? If there's a scene that an enourmous chunk of the playerbase will never ever see because it's been buried too deeply into the game to find and has such a high annoyance factor that people won't like it, doesn't that lower the objective quality of the game? Don't tell me you LIKE having to walk back and fourth through three quarters of the game thus far! Eiji, Rei, even Fouron would be ashamed!

Maybe I'm spoiled. I'm currently trying out another RPGMaker game called Harem, which, despite its MANY, many objective flaws, DOES teleport you around when you finish part of a quest instead of making you hoof it back and fourth across half the map for no reason.

As to him popping up before Gwen... eh? I don't get it. I mean, you run into Orpheus AND Wolfram first anyway, and Lanie says both of them are hot too. If the player wants to go after Gwen, they'll go after Gwen. If they don't (and, if I don't feel it fits the character I'm playing, I don't) then they won't. There's no beating the quest BEFORE you have that chance ANYWAY.

Have mercy. If you don't take any of my advice about "backtracking" for the rest of the quest, at least alter the trigger so you don't need to beat X-man to start it. Otherwise... well, some people don't like using guides to get through games, and there's a whole TvTropes page full of stuff people complain practically NEEDS a guide to get through.

I think the key word is "thus far", it seems like a huge backtrack but if you keep in mind it's the first area of the game, I don't know, I have a huge background on RPG's and well, old days Final Fantasy had a lot of back and forth, Betrayal at Krondor was even worse, I wouldn't mind having the option for immediately being teleported back to Renford, but I just feel that the game thus far is too straightforward but again, might be just me. So yes, I'm sort of a backtracking fan (as long as it's not HUGE and annoying, which this one obviously isn't).

Wolfram and Orpheus unlike Gwyn (most of the times) do not join the party. But again, Gwyn is already a non-playing third wheel in the game (most of it)

I think this is due to the fact that she isn't introduced (even text-wise) in the game, therefore I have a suggestion KITAmaru.

How about you make it that if you try to go back with Gwyn in your party she says something like: "I don't want to go back to those chambers, I have bad memories of it" and she leaves your party? That way it wouldn't have to not make sense! And when you proceed with the quest she joins your party again, pretty much like Barret in Final Fantasy 7 when Barret leaves your party during the corel scene, anyway yeah, just a suggestion.

[KITAmaru]

Nah, I already said I would do the whole instant teleport back thing. What I should've done was let the beta testers hoof it as well instead of putting the books nearby so they could all scream foul or something, but eh, can't catch em all right away. You also have a point about the Xanrud thing, since Orpheus and Wolfram are also potential love interests; though it's not as heated as Gwyn, I suppose they could always go back to Renford.

You see, the whole Gwyn thing is kinda bothering me so what I'm working on right now is including brief 'add-ons' to H-scenes (like with the gargoyle, the brawlers, etc) as a conditional branch. NO, I'm not making entirely new scenes for every single one Gwyn is involved in. Just not time-effective. But including CG's as well as involving her in more of the cutscenes (perhaps including a temporary leave during Lanie's little sidequest, as soon as I figure it out) are easy enough to do without killing immersion too much. What I mean by CG in this case, is just me reusing one pose file and replacing it with Gwyn, essentially, which takes a lot less time than attempting to re-write an entire scene, of which there are already plenty to begin with. That should be a decent balance between time consumption and quality, I think. But eh, either way I'll worry about it more when I get there, as I have a looooot of scenes to add emotes to.

And hey, I personally think Harem is great; I actually wouldn't have made DLaby without it! I started out by making poses for ker for a short while, but wound up making my own game, mainly 'cause I liked the idea of multiple playable characters with converging paths. Also kind of a cheap excuse to reuse pose files, but eh. Turned out good so far! Just gotta keep plugging away.

Also, nearly 4K downloads in the first four days. o_o; Hurray, I think...

[StarkePT]

Nah, I already said I would do the whole instant teleport back thing. What I should've done was let the beta testers hoof it as well instead of putting the books nearby so they could all scream foul or something, but eh, can't catch em all right away. You also have a point about the Xanrud thing, since Orpheus and Wolfram are also potential love interests; though it's not as heated as Gwyn, I suppose they could always go back to Renford.

You see, the whole Gwyn thing is kinda bothering me so what I'm working on right now is including brief 'add-ons' to H-scenes (like with the gargoyle, the brawlers, etc) as a conditional branch. NO, I'm not making entirely new scenes for every single one Gwyn is involved in. Just not time-effective. But including CG's as well as involving her in more of the cutscenes (perhaps including a temporary leave during Lanie's little sidequest, as soon as I figure it out) are easy enough to do without killing immersion too much. What I mean by CG in this case, is just me reusing one pose file and replacing it with Gwyn, essentially, which takes a lot less time than attempting to re-write an entire scene, of which there are already plenty to begin with. That should be a decent balance between time consumption and quality, I think. But eh, either way I'll worry about it more when I get there, as I have a looooot of scenes to add emotes to.

And hey, I personally think Harem is great; I actually wouldn't have made DLaby without it! I started out by making poses for ker for a short while, but wound up making my own game, mainly 'cause I liked the idea of multiple playable characters with converging paths. Also kind of a cheap excuse to reuse pose files, but eh. Turned out good so far! Just gotta keep plugging away.

Also, nearly 4K downloads in the first four days. o_o; Hurray, I think...

4K? Blowing out of proportion... Maybe I should actually get into the RPGMaker thingy and try to give you a hand with what I can, guess I found a new hobby xD

[SpectralTime]

I'm okay with Gwen just not showing up in a lot of "pose" images. It's not the BIGGEST bit of suspension of disbelief I've had to put on in this game (if nothing else, the whole "waiting til the night of the next day before having a romantic dinner date in a rape dungeon" bit got a raised eyebrow but little else, unlike, say, Elysium's main character if you play him as a good guy in general), so I'm fine with it. Maybe she's unconscious. Maybe she's distracted by a shiny object. (Happens to the best of us.) Maybe SHE found a pair of adorable twin brother sex slaves to gently make love to and promise to free next door. I don't feel the need to ask, and don't mind when the game doesn't tell.

Really, I think the big problem is that in Final Fantasy or Zelda, wandering around looking for stuff is a big part of the game, since they're made by teams of people who can add minigames and whatnot, but, here, now, there's really not that much to do BESIDES hoof it back and fourth, once you've cleaned out all the treasure on the first trip. There AREN'T really a whole lot of extra goodies to find or minigames to do, ESPECIALLY not if you're doing a high-purity run, which, to finish the quest, you kind of have to.

But he's already fixing that problem, so I'll drop it.

I'm... not sure how to interpret that statement, so, again, here's my opinion: just trigger it after the sailor fight, alter the start dialogue to include him thanking her for getting rid of the ruckus, and just let it progress naturally from there. Lowers the "frustration factor" and eliminates the need to walk back and fourth through three-quarters of the dungeon over and over again before you beat up the Arcane Division and (this is a big presumption on my part) start using their teleporters to get around.

I know you really like Gwen, and, to be honest, Lanie IS one of the characters I feel comfortable going after her with, but, again, there's no reason not to just give the player the chance to do as they please, because, again, the quest can only get through the first THIRD without meeting her anyway.

...Unless you're already taking my advice. I honestly couldn't tell. But, between adding Gwen in and redoing all the portraits, that sounds like an awful lot of maintenance work, is all, and I hope you don't bore yourself sick on all the "busywork" so that you don't find yourself enjoying the rest of the game.

Good luck, mate. And I'll be okay even if you DON'T take my advice.

(Actually, I think leaving the stuff in the upper corner of the room, which I didn't notice until you pointed it out again, combined with my general desire to only make qualitative complaints AFTER the official bit had come out to see if you'd put in more stuff to smooth it over in-between, is the REASON I didn't complain until after. I think. It's been a while. Anyway, I'm sorry if you thought I was feeling more passionate than I actually was, because I didn't mean to "scream foul" as much as make an objective assessment. I reserve conjoining the two for, say, the ending to Mass Effect 3. Thanks again, and good luck.)

[Lucky777]

Lol high-purity dating-sim fetch-quests.

[SpectralTime]

Eh, I'm willing to jump through some hoops for guilt-free enjoyment. Besides, it's a mid-purity fetch quest.

[Lucky777]

Guilt free?

Shit, breakin' 'em IS guilt free.

You're really poor rapist material, bro.

Unfortunately, that's a positive qualification.

Hahaha

[StarkePT]

I see you guys didn't get the W-Item Materia in Final Fantasy 7 xD

All jokes aside, if he goes and puts Gwyn in every little spot so that it makes sense, what happens when/if you get a third character in your party? He'll have to do it again for that character? Hell no.

[SpectralTime]

...Actually, I meant guilt-free for the girl to enjoy. But, come to think, that works too.

All jokes aside, if he goes and puts Gwyn in every little spot so that it makes sense, what happens when/if you get a third character in your party? He'll have to do it again for that character? Hell no.

I know, right?

[Lucky777]

Eh, it's mainly guilt-free for the girls once you fuck the stupid out of their heads, though Irine appears to be the current quarter-way exception.

I'm assuming she's going to require a bit more long-term work, but it's nothing that'll be impossible.

And yeah the Gwyn thing's a lot of busywork, not to mention with the other characters that come along, but it's the kind of thing that can be done over a long stretch o' time.

[Vid]

Hey KITA, how do you get the scene with Thyme while playing as Irine? It says in the library - the one on the right in the new area, correct? Do you need a certain purity, or something else? There's been some cool stuff in this update, but it seems like a lot of the new stuff is really hard to find, like that Lanie quest.

[StarkePT]

Man I remember when I first looked at the v0.08 waiting for the new update, this was me: