Despair Labyrinth (RPG) Latest Release: Ver.0.09 (4/18/12)

[KITAmaru]

Yurtigo-
Seems like a great idea but the problem with me is, I can only think up so many different types of rooms. I'm trying to make the bandit hideout a surprisingly extensive but luxurious one (seeing the Syndicate's hookups), and already have a solid storyline ready to go for the most part; I'm pretty much out of ideas when it comes to extra areas as I already have a ton lined up, and would be hard-pressed to find more unless I simply make another character go in reverse.
Basically what I'm trying to do is show how each character reacts to the same situation with the things they say and sometimes do. It's kind of cheap, I know, but saves me a LOT of development time for possibly more hours played. Unique scenes for characters will generally be implemented every other patch, if I can help it--even the dungeon intro you saw took me over half a week to write, and that's with a lot of spare time. x_x;
I apologize; I don't mean to sound lazy or anything, but splitting paths would make even small updates like these be a matter of months instead of days, seeing as I do the writing and coding (as well as the corrections from my grammar-checkers) by myself.

Lucky-
Asella has a built-in skill called Pharmacology (passive skill not listed in game), which doubles the effectiveness of Potions. I gave it to her, seeing as she was the 'tank' type character, but on second thought... Do you think it would be good for me to give it to the caster classes in the interest of balance, or would this simply be a bit too overpowered?

Kuragari-
Hahaha, yeah, that was basically my response to people complaining about Irine being weak. I was like 'hmm, how to make a 'fuck you up' spell...'--but worry not, like I said, combat still has a LOT of balancing and to be honest, it's generally the thing I spend the LEAST time on due to how tedious it can be. If people wanna help with that, be my guest, but I'm not expecting anything huge, as it's only really a secondary feature of the game, obviously. ;3

To avoid the annoyance of autorun scripts and any complications they might cause, I've decided that I'm pretty much going to only make 0 or less Purity have a bearing at the very end, because a 'surprise Game Over' after leveling up / getting equipment / unlocking cutscene would honestly be annoying as shit, especially if I forgot to save.

[Lucky777]

Hmm. Well, it's good to know the 600 hp wasn't a bug. Would be nice to see the stat itself listed somewhere later, but it's not a priority, I guess : O

As to giving it to the caster classes as well, that'd probably be pretty cool, especially for the later bosses. At the moment, it doesn't seem necessary, but I can easily imagine later bosses being able to oneshot the squishies, since some current ones can already TWOSHOT them. It might also come in handy in combination with the armour spell, so that instead of only having one turn to attack between pots, the caster classes could get two.

The balance discussion is just something I'm talking about in thin air, though. I'm not an authority on that at all. "What I want to see" I can say with relative certainty, but "what will keep the game at the difficulty level you want" is probably something that needs a bit more trial and error.

As to having the 0 purity affect the very ending only: "Yes. *brofist.* THAT IS ALL, SIR."

After all, I'm sick and tired of seeing h-games suffer the stupidity of missing the point of being an h-game, and of making it so that you have to avoid the one thing that you're in the fucking game to DO in the first place. It's like killing yourself to achieve longer physical life. That is: it's unspeakably foolish and quite remarkably counterproductive.

[Kuragari]

Okay, what about if you actually hit -100 it game overs. Because at that point, I'd have to scream "MIND BREAK" and say the characters had it. I think only people who are actively doing nothing but the fucking would reach that point, and in my opinion would actually be a useful deterrent to the "Fuck'em all" strategy, as doing the fucking gains you no experience. And if you don't have experience, you can't get past the bosses and get the rest of the juicy H-scenes. Oh sure, its fun to save right before the boss, lose, and see what if any H-scene you get, but you need to be able to get past the bosses to get to the other scenes.

Is that good enough for you Lucky?

[Lucky777]

Ye can grind to raise your experience when you need to fight. That's how I handle beating the boss in THIS iteration of the game, and I've done it with no problems, with all of the characters.

No game over from negative purity, bro.

(Surely I'm not the one writing or making the game, but that is my definitive stand.)

[KITAmaru]

If I must do a Game Over due to 0 or less Purity, I would make it at a certain scene or when in the Chambers only for purposes of continuity. I mean, if you get raped by one monster in an otherwise deserted room and then all of a sudden end up being a slave, it might be less believable in a way. Not that anything in this game is believable, mind you, LOL. I understand what you are saying though Kura, as it's not like the character is going to get violated like OVER 9000 times and still just be dandy about it.

Don't worry--given the premise of this game, mind break will definitely, definitely happen for people who are looking for it. I just need to find a good balance between function with story flow, as I don't want to frustrate people with surprise game-overs. If I do make a pre-ending Game Over, it will likely be seen coming, due to my personal preference. I remember playing the Grrl Power! Project and when my character died in the hideout instead of being screwed cause of taking too much damage (which was poor design imo, a shame due to the other great features in-game), I was like 'FFFFFFFFFFFFFFFF...' Mainly because I'd forget to save.

In other news, already started writing the next scenes (via WordPad, anyway).

[Kuragari]

Its not just about the sex you know. If thats all your interested in, just ask for the CG's in a PM. I played it to see the sex scenes true, but I like RPG's in general, and I am also interested in the storyline.

I don't know about you, but seeing the same scene over and over and over and over and over and over and over again is just pointless.

If your not going to have a game over at -100 purity points, then you should simply set it so it doesn't go lower than 0, and that when you reach the end, it effects your ending.

Seriously, some, and in fact many would argue that 0 purity points rates the character as a slut, but -100 would rate them as a mind broken sex-slave cum dumpster.

Oh, well, I have no probelm with it going neccessarily below 0, its just if someone were able to reach -100 (or even beyond that) it'd be...welll...odd.

Also, true, monster may just leave her there, but the idea would be that at -100, to make it interesting, her mind breaks and rather than getting up and continuing the quest, she goes off the look for more cocks, which could give you the mind break scene and then the game over scene.

[KITAmaru]

I actually didn't mean for it to even be at negative to begin with, I just haven't figured out how to define the maximum and minimum of certain variables when I implemented the method to display one's Purity.

It IS indeed weird to see Purity at a negative value (on a file I was testing with, I think my character had like -140 Purity due to a Purity-decreasing test NPC I had implemented) so if it bothers people that much, I'm just going to implement an NPC that gives a rough estimate and for game design purposes, negative Purity will generally be treated as 0 until I can find a way to enforce zero as the minimum, which honestly shouldn't take much at all besides a Google search or two.

[Lucky777]

Firstly, it'd be the Cgs AND the writing that I'd have to request, because srsly, the writing of the scenes is a large part of their win.

Secondly, I AM interested in the plot. It's just that I'm on the syndicate's side. When we get that "join the syndicate" option, I'm gonna be right there with it, and no matter HOW pure the character started, she's going to be a loyal syndicate slut who fights to the death to defend them. It's even part of why I grind on KO'ing dudes in the chambers - because I'm not killing any more of my future allies than I have to.

Thirdly, the same scene over and over is grinding, bro. It's like the same battle over and over. Gotta have some patience for repetition in rpgs, if you want to arrive at your goal ... or at least that's how they're generally built. In some cases, more patience than I have is necessary. (Jrpg grinding lol)

HOWEVER

While I've stated my opinion and am as clear on the opinion as I am about anything else, I accept that the final choice is and must be up to the game creator. Whichever way it goes, it goes - and guilt trips and bitching are both out of the question - but everyone knows my stand, which is good enough for me.

[KITAmaru]

Honestly, I don't feel it's really that huge of an issue--I can implement it sooner or later (though admittedly, more requests may have an impact on if its the former or the latter), and it wouldn't really change the game's core events either way. I'm just focusing on trying to put new areas now, as well as characters / scenes, etc. because as it stands, there's not like a huge amount of gameplay, especially if you only use one character--but of course, where's the fun in that?
Ideally, I'd like this game to be at least a couple hours to play all the way through. I think I have a lot of fun and interesting characters / scenarios to introduce and that's what I'm going to focus on right now.

[haloman]

Just one question, Can you post the game here (so you dont have to download it) I cant use wither of them (reached my download limit) as for other reasons. Im sure other people would apritiate that as well. Just remove the old game and replace it with teh newer version whenever you update the game!

[KITAmaru]

Oh, you mean post it here as many people do with their Flash files? Unfortunately, that isn't quite possible as it is only played on the RPG Maker VX runtime package, so it actually does need to be downloaded, unfortunately.

[haloman]

Ah... well that... sucks >.< Ah well. Just because one person cant play it doesnt meen others cant enjoy it I wish you luck friend. *holds out a hand to shake*

[KITAmaru]

If I could somehow send it to you in a way that would bypass whatever download limit you appear to have (is it ISP based?), I would, really.

[kronos]

for the game ending at 0 purity or whatever, why not make it a choice, like in the chambers, one of those stalls are open when your at 0 purity, and the guard says something along the lines of "hey girl, you wanna turn?" then your character thinks "i know if i go in, ill never get out of there, but so many cocks, i need to save the princess, but so many cocks"
then a choice of "stay behind as a slave" and "resist and continue the quest"



or something along those lines

[ExistentialGhost]

About the negative Purity / mind-break: I agree that from a pure logic standpoint, you can't just keep getting fucked silly over and over again and then be on your merry way like nothing happened. Also, if you look at your typical eroge, they all have some sort of "bad end" if you fail to meet the original objective of the game. Here, you're given the task of saving a Princess and getting a shitload of money in return - so if you decide halfway that the Dark Side is the way to go for you, you should reach a "bad end". Bear in mind though, that "bad end" doesn't necessarily mean crappy end - for those of you who've played Bible Black, the ending "Evil Never Dies" is considered a "bad end", but in terms of scene, it's probably the one that rocks the most

If you want to implement a fairly simple solution for now, how about: if your Purity hits 0 or less, when you reach the final boss, you only have one option, i.e. submitting (putting the "Game Over" back in GOR, so to speak).
For a somewhat more satisfying approach to mind-break, you should draw some inspiration from The Call of Cthulhu table-top RPG and its rules on Sanity - http://www.chaosium.com/forms/coc_quick_start_color.pdf can give you a very simple overview of how it works (you'd need the full rulebook for all the details, if you're interested I can probably dig it up - still, check page 9 for the basic rules on Sanity, and page 18 for the small paragraph on Temporary Insanity).

I don't know how many people share Lucky's goal of becoming a member of the Syndicate, nor if it's even the direction Kitamaru wants to take his game. If it *is* an option though, then I'd suggest something like this: if your Purity is at 0 or lower when you reach a boss (it has to be at keypoints in the game, and not just at some random encounter), you have the option to say you want to join the Syndicate's side. But because they won't just accept anyone, you still have to fight the boss - to prove your skills. Lose, and it's off to the Chambers with you, you just aren't good enough. Win, and now that you've proven your fighting skils, you have to prove your allegiance... with your body. H-scene with the boss for your hard efforts, yay! With that done though, I don't know how the rest of the game would develop - because you're clearly not looking for the Princess anymore at this point. Perhaps the Syndicate reassigns your priorities, and gives you the order to hunt down whichever male NPC good guy, like Orpheus, is roaming around in the Labyrinth? That guy would then become your "final boss" or something, I guess.

[LexRage77]

I write just for congratulating you. You've done a really nice job on this project ! I hope you'll continue man, that's amazing.


( Ah yes: i've voted for Irine and Sairyn )

[KITAmaru]

Lex: Thanks!

Yeah, like I said; the negative value was never TRULY intended in the first place (as you can see some of my earlier posts thought 0 would be the very bottom) so it just causes other problems for me. Kronos' suggestion was very similar to what I had in mind; like if you're IN the Chambers and your Purity reaches 0, well, it's somewhat predictable what would happen. Obviously the game is kinda unfinished at the moment so the Chambers is basically a huge playground containing most of what there is to do, but in the future that'll change, so. Don't worry, I can also adjust Purity modifiers at any time as well for people who want to see more or less overall scenes in their game.

Naw... Becoming a Syndicate member will certainly be an option but as I said before, there are so many things, character and storyline wise, that I would like to flesh out and soon, so that it can be an ongoing thing. People (as well as the characters themselves) need time to get attached to even fictional characters, and I want to introduce a lot of the planned cast, friend and foe alike, as soon as possible so that the audience can get used to them and so it won't feel like they're just being shoved down your throat, or that the game was a single-minded fuckfest until 6 months later where they tried to introduce 'STORYLINE, what's that?' kind of thing. I was pretty happy to see that some people already liked the dominatrix, who was by all means intended to be a minor and inconsequential character for the most part.

Purity at 0 or less causing a Game Over at -key points- such as certain events or obviously named enemies is absolutely acceptable to me. I didn't wanna go with insta-gameoverscreen because of the potential frustration it would cause people (and is really a mood killer for me, personally).

Funny thing is, originally Kalen was going to offer you to join the Syndicate, but the possibilities and time spent just increased tenfold once I got into that (if possible I'd like the Syndicate option to be a mini-route instead of a generic game over screen), not to mention I'm not quite sure that the very first boss should be given such a privilege. Maybe the second or third, though. ;3

[AbysmalTears]

Actually very interested in seeing the Syndicate member option. Just by looking at the requests though it sounds like you're pretty swamped Kit

If there's anything you need help on i'd be glad to do so. I am pretty good at creating scenarios so maybe i can help out in the storyline department?

[Lucky777]

. But because they won't just accept anyone, you still have to fight the boss - to prove your skills. Lose, and it's off to the Chambers with you, you just aren't good enough. Win, and now that you've proven your fighting skils, you have to prove your allegiance... with your body. H-scene with the boss for your hard efforts, yay! With that done though, I don't know how the rest of the game would develop - because you're clearly not looking for the Princess anymore at this point. Perhaps the Syndicate reassigns your priorities, and gives you the order to hunt down whichever male NPC good guy, like Orpheus, is roaming around in the Labyrinth? That guy would then become your "final boss" or something, I guess.

This is pretty much my exact line of thinking. The cutscenes and bosses would change, and the generic enemies would change. Like, instead of being bandits, they'd end up being Elynsor Knights or something, the cutscenes would end up with different dialogue and different sprites for the boss battle too, and instead of the final boss being you aiding one of the male NPCs and/or a bunch of knights against some syndicate badass, it'd be you aiding some syndicate (Not - so - badass) against one or more of the male NPCs and/or a bunch of knights.

I say not-so-badass because if you have "THE FINAL BOSS OF THE GAME" on your side IN the actual fight, I can't imagine that it'll be too much of a challenge. XD. Maybe an underling or something.

[KITAmaru]

Well, that all sounds good and fine to me, and is something I'd be willing to do. Doesn't seem all that difficult to script really. Even more interesting would be that as bosses, you'd fight some of the other adventurers or characters that would otherwise be protagonists in the regular game, whom you could send to the Chambers yourself after you win (so it's a win H-scene instead of a lose H-scene). Likely that would have to wait for the halfway point though, and as it stands, I don't think I'm even 1/8 or 1/10th through the game. Great ideas though.

In other news, I have tons of events but I would like assistants (or even just anyone, if you have solid ideas) to PM me their ideas for environments in the dungeon. I have about 6 lined up thus far, and obviously I'm not just going to take every idea that pops up, but help would be nice--I'll likely use certain rooms as the backdrop for story ideas.

Obviously, a lot of the time spent is on writing--even generic scenes, to some extent, require a slightly different reaction or manner of speech from each character. Sairyn tends to speak properly, as Elynsorian language (translated to English for your convenience ;D) is not her native tongue, whereas Rhiannon tends to mix in lots of foul language, Lanie likes to use abbreviations, and so on. I would say that on days that I have to work, writing a single scene tends to take me about a day (with the 2-3 free hours I have available) and even longer the more 'unique' features I choose to include. However, I feel that this is a tedious but necessary part of the game, in order to add enrichment of sorts. Some 'generic' scenes, if you haven't already noticed, get a lot of extra dialogue depending on the character that you've chosen.